The Next DSI Synthesizer

Discussion about Dave Smith Instruments, upcoming and potentially-upcoming instruments.

Re: The Next DSI Synthesizer

Postby dslsynth » Fri Jun 27, 2014 11:34 am

@cr73645: Exactly my kind of lyrics! I look forward to DSI or someone else inventing good stable digitally controlled analog oscillators for inclusion in DSI and/or MI designs. MI designs really shines in the filter section with their discrete component designs. But listening at the MI designs it almost sound as if the DSI design have better sound quality.

Have anyone seen or heard the MI Shruthi-1 4-Pole Mission? Its based on the good old Oberheim Xpander pole mixing filter design. Having DSI and Moog doing something similar with their discrete filter designs are going to get really interesting for advanced voice architecture addicts like myself.

I am by no means an electronics wizard. But looking at how an analog oscillator is made its obvious that great results can be made from fairly simple discrete components given smart and fast enough processors with D/A and A/D converters. And expert level control system knowledge of cause. However when it comes to analog electronics I am way better at dreaming than inventing. So someone else have to move that sled in the right direction.

I can still see the value of new DSI designs with the Curtis filter as its cheaper and sounds good enough for many uses. Imagine replacing the current Prophet 12 with a Oberheim two pole SVF, enable the analog oscillators on the Curtis chip and add analog filter feedback. That would make a nice sounding box for those of us that really love the Evolver. A two or four voice module with such a design would be lovely for my uses.

Or said in another word: I vote for hybrid oscillator sections. . o O ( what else is new!? )
User avatar
dslsynth
 
Posts: 296
Joined: Sun Jun 22, 2014 4:45 pm
Location: Denmark

Re: The Next DSI Synthesizer

Postby Bald Eagle » Sun Jun 29, 2014 3:50 am

I have never been a big fan of modules in the past, But I would jump on a Pro 2 module for $1200. But there would have to be a really good PC editor to go along with it.
User avatar
Bald Eagle
 
Posts: 72
Joined: Sat Jun 28, 2014 4:41 am
Location: Long Island, NY

Re: The Next DSI Synthesizer

Postby cr73645 » Sun Jun 29, 2014 1:08 pm

@dslsynth
The 4PM is the most amazing piece of gear in such a small box I've ever seen. That filter is simply amazing! I can't believe that they were able to fit it in such a small place. There's just so many options that possibilities are endless! The Midnight Shruthi is also very nice. I actually think that those filter designs are so good that building several Shruthis just for filter flavor is acceptable.

I also vote for hybrid oscillators!! :)
Prophet '08 PE | Little Phatty Stage II | Sub Phatty | Ambika 6xSMR4 | Anushri
YouTube: http://www.youtube.com/synthway
cr73645
 
Posts: 63
Joined: Thu Jun 26, 2014 11:28 am

Re: The Next DSI Synthesizer

Postby dslsynth » Sun Jun 29, 2014 1:24 pm

@cr73645: Thanks for the filter board niceness confirmation - and gear envy emotions! ;-)
User avatar
dslsynth
 
Posts: 296
Joined: Sun Jun 22, 2014 4:45 pm
Location: Denmark

Re: The Next DSI Synthesizer

Postby Razmo » Sun Jun 29, 2014 10:52 pm

About the Pro 2 module...

I certainly hope it will see the light of day... and as has been mentioned already, the Pro 2 does have an extra MIDI output labelled Thru/Out 2, but what this is intended for may be just guesswork... but it could be to add a module somehow.

There is just one question regarding such an add-on module because how do you make polyphony with such a module, if the Pro 2 is paraphonic? ... it would not work very well having eight voices, running in two sections through a filter section... and in the end, buying a module of that pricepoint, for just one extra voice seems a bit overkill does it not?

Personaly I don't really believe we'll see a polychainable feature in this... besides, the point of the Pro 2 according to Dave was to make the ultimate monosynth, so why make it polyphonic? it does not make sense really, but I guess we'll see what the future brings.

I do know that many are already beginning to request a module version... I've seen it a few times now, so I believe Dave will make one, even if it's meant to work standalone, but as usual, he will not release it until he's sold a fair deal of the keyboard version I asume... but I don't mind... I'll wait for the module, and in the meantime, the OS can mature a bit, and I can research it's specs in more detail... especialy the MIDI specs :mrgreen:
User avatar
Razmo
 
Posts: 487
Joined: Sun Jun 29, 2014 7:29 pm

Re: The Next DSI Synthesizer

Postby Razmo » Sun Jun 29, 2014 11:03 pm

One obvious feature for the second MIDI output could be to integrate it with a modular setup... Modular's could have more than one MIDI->CV converter module, and the second output could for example be used to send out the internal sequencers note data, while the other is connected to the keyboard instead... the Pro 2 was obviously made to be very modular integrateable, so this might be one use for the second output I think.

Also, when thinking about it... on the Tetra and P08, the second output is labeled "Poly Chain Out"... it was designed for this... but on the P12 it's labeled "MIDI Thru" and there is not any polychainable features in the P12.... on the Pro 2 it just says "Thru/MIDI Out 2".... to me this indicates that DSI has not designed the Pro 2 (or the P12 for that matter) for polychain expansions.

Just guessing of course...
User avatar
Razmo
 
Posts: 487
Joined: Sun Jun 29, 2014 7:29 pm

Re: The Next DSI Synthesizer

Postby chysn » Sun Jun 29, 2014 11:52 pm

My imagination fails me. I'm having a hard time thinking of a situation for which two MIDI outs would be really useful.

For instruments with Poly Chain, the Poly Chain jack behaves as a second MIDI out when Poly Chain is turned off. Perhaps this "Out/Thru" jack on the Pro2 is sort of a software throwback. I use my Poly Chain jack as my MIDI out, but only because my MIDI Out/Thru is set to "Thru."

If they're adding a third MIDI jack in lieu of Poly Chain, a second Thru would almost always be more useful than a second Out.
DSI: Evolver #1431
Other Synths: Moog Little Phatty Stage II (Red), Arturia MicroBrute
Other Hardware: Alesis MMT-8, Korg Volca Beats
DAW: Reaper for OSX through PreSonus AudioBox USB
chysn
Site Admin
 
Posts: 256
Joined: Sun Jun 22, 2014 12:58 am
Location: Metro Detroit, Michigan, USA

Re: The Next DSI Synthesizer

Postby cbmd » Mon Jun 30, 2014 12:07 am

Many applications for two MIDI outputs... here's one. A sequencer track can be assigned to send note/velocity data to either MIDI output on any channel.

You could connect a Tetra to one MIDI output address each voice on a separate sequencer track on the Pro 2. Connect the other output to a Tempest and play poly rhythmic MIDI lines from another couple Pro 2 sequencer tracks. You could then chain through the aforementioned devices to other MIDI sources.

Lot's of possibilities with the Pro 2!
Carson Day
Dave Smith Instruments
cbmd
 
Posts: 22
Joined: Sun Jun 29, 2014 9:22 am

Re: The Next DSI Synthesizer

Postby Bald Eagle » Mon Jun 30, 2014 12:39 am

chysn wrote:My imagination fails me. I'm having a hard time thinking of a situation for which two MIDI outs would be really useful.


For me it would not be useful unless it involved some specialized method of poly chaining. The second MIDI out on the Pro 2 is just a configurable THRU anyway. I route all my MIDI through a MOTU midi manager but a second MIDI out could be useful for smaller rigs.

DSI has said that the Pro 2 could be the control center. In that case there should have been at least 4 MIDI outs. Hell, Dave invented it after all ... What was he thinking, only 2 outs?
User avatar
Bald Eagle
 
Posts: 72
Joined: Sat Jun 28, 2014 4:41 am
Location: Long Island, NY

Re: The Next DSI Synthesizer

Postby Sacred Synthesis » Mon Jun 30, 2014 1:04 am

There will be a Pro 2 Module, I have no doubt, simply because that's how Dave Smith works. And there is already an enthusiastic demand for it. Dave provided the MIDI jacks because he knows people will experiment with various configurations, including linking Pro 2 Modules to the Keyboard. This could be for multi-timbrality purposes, which would make the Pro 2 quite a powerful mono synth. I'd certainly be interested in such a configuration.
Sacred Synthesis
 

Re: The Next DSI Synthesizer

Postby chysn » Mon Jun 30, 2014 1:48 am

cbmd wrote:Many applications for two MIDI outputs... here's one. A sequencer track can be assigned to send note/velocity data to either MIDI output on any channel.


Ah ha. The thing that I missed was that the outs are independently configurable. I incorrectly assumed that it was similar to the simple two-outs (Poly Chain off) configuration of previous DSI keyboards.

It still seems esoteric, and that most things can be accomplished with thrus, but more options is better, I suppose.
DSI: Evolver #1431
Other Synths: Moog Little Phatty Stage II (Red), Arturia MicroBrute
Other Hardware: Alesis MMT-8, Korg Volca Beats
DAW: Reaper for OSX through PreSonus AudioBox USB
chysn
Site Admin
 
Posts: 256
Joined: Sun Jun 22, 2014 12:58 am
Location: Metro Detroit, Michigan, USA

Re: The Next DSI Synthesizer

Postby Razmo » Mon Jun 30, 2014 6:50 am

Sacred Synthesis wrote:There will be a Pro 2 Module, I have no doubt, simply because that's how Dave Smith works. And there is already an enthusiastic demand for it. Dave provided the MIDI jacks because he knows people will experiment with various configurations, including linking Pro 2 Modules to the Keyboard. This could be for multi-timbrality purposes, which would make the Pro 2 quite a powerful mono synth. I'd certainly be interested in such a configuration.


Multitimbrality yes... if they are seperate mono machines could be done with an extra output like this, but it would be just as good using two MIDI ports on your MIDI interface then.

But I'd still like to hear how you could possibly configure a polychainable system with Pro 2 modules, when the Pro 2 is Paraphonic? ... The Pro 2 has 4 voices, and they all go thru the same two monophonic filters, so two of these modules chained up for 8 voices would still only have 2 dual filters for 8 voices... what do you route to what, and how would it sound?

I can understand the interrest in polychaining the Pro 2, but I just don't see how it's going to be possible, unless the Pro 2 is set up to play either monophonicaly when polychained, or in unison mode.... this though, would certainly be possible.... but with the pricepoint of the Pro 2, I hardly think many would ever use it.
User avatar
Razmo
 
Posts: 487
Joined: Sun Jun 29, 2014 7:29 pm

Re: The Next DSI Synthesizer

Postby namnibor » Mon Jun 30, 2014 10:59 am

cbmd wrote:Many applications for two MIDI outputs... here's one. A sequencer track can be assigned to send note/velocity data to either MIDI output on any channel.

You could connect a Tetra to one MIDI output address each voice on a separate sequencer track on the Pro 2. Connect the other output to a Tempest and play poly rhythmic MIDI lines from another couple Pro 2 sequencer tracks. You could then chain through the aforementioned devices to other MIDI sources.

Lot's of possibilities with the Pro 2!


See, I noticed back in shadows of the Pro 2 Presentation posted at Matrixynth,there lurked a Tetra while I drooled over an interesting sequencer, then, and THEN...noticed the DSI CURTIS FILTER Eurorack module beyond deeper that Tetra module on table behind Pro 2. My Tetra and some CV gear is ready for both midi and control voltages done right with a sensible interface....yeah...I am still hating on Elektron....that was another recent twilight zone I am recovering from...anyway, the Pro 2 interests me...PLEASE more specs on the sequencer lines, control, poly...fed back into the Pro 2 L/R External Inputs....there you can make whatever hybrid you want....even adding sampling and looping, fx chaines...et al!!
To be honest, if this preferred type of filter configuration and sequencer and cv/midi abilities were ALL on the P12 standard from the start, I would have one and am glad I have waited. If the old forum ever resurrects itself you can read my few posts stating those were needed for me and since I am into many layers, one or two voices from each synth is all that's needed, esp. in Ambient I am doing. The Pro , I predict, is hiding one huge not yet revealed surprise...perhaps a few...but the 'biggie' will be at NAMM here in few weeks. DSI still has not added anything new I can see to their YOU TUBE channel, which I am subscribed, and cannot find any YT Pro 2 anything. What's up with that?
This is going to get me down the path of modular...just keep sliding pizza's under my door and never need to leave!!!! LOL!! :twisted: :shock: :twisted:
Just an alien living amongst humanity...we are almost finished, just have a bit more probing to do.
User avatar
namnibor
 
Posts: 110
Joined: Sun Jun 22, 2014 4:17 am

Re: The Next DSI Synthesizer

Postby Sacred Synthesis » Mon Jun 30, 2014 4:18 pm

Razmo wrote:I can understand the interrest in polychaining the Pro 2, but I just don't see how it's going to be possible, unless the Pro 2 is set up to play either monophonicaly when polychained, or in unison mode.... this though, would certainly be possible.... but with the pricepoint of the Pro 2, I hardly think many would ever use it.


I don't know what Dave has in mind with this. Perhaps future updates will explain it all. But this is precisely the configuration I had in mind - a monophonic bi-timbral option.
Sacred Synthesis
 

Re: The Next DSI Synthesizer

Postby Razmo » Mon Jun 30, 2014 4:35 pm

Sacred Synthesis wrote:
Razmo wrote:I can understand the interrest in polychaining the Pro 2, but I just don't see how it's going to be possible, unless the Pro 2 is set up to play either monophonicaly when polychained, or in unison mode.... this though, would certainly be possible.... but with the pricepoint of the Pro 2, I hardly think many would ever use it.


I don't know what Dave has in mind with this. Perhaps future updates will explain it all. But this is precisely the configuration I had in mind - a monophonic bi-timbral option.


If you watch Dave's release video, it's clear that the extra MIDI output is meant for controlling external gear from the sequencer... he say that outright in the video, so I don't think they have any plans on poly or bitimbral usage, but you never know... enough users to request it, and it might... we'll just have to wait and see :)
User avatar
Razmo
 
Posts: 487
Joined: Sun Jun 29, 2014 7:29 pm

Re: The Next DSI Synthesizer

Postby dslsynth » Mon Jun 30, 2014 4:42 pm

I noticed a patch name in the announcement video where the word "para" occured. So let me guess that presets have to be programmed to be paraphonic and its not just a single switch. Maybe the oscillator settings matters much like running a Tetra in combo mode without unison mode set which gets round robin on the voice allocation. But lets have Carson explain the details. Or wait for the DSI manual at the end of next month or so.

I really like the idea of the new sequencer. Very much a good step forward from the Evolver design. Carsons explanation makes me wonder how the MIDI channel of a sequencer track is set and if polyphonic sequences are supported.
User avatar
dslsynth
 
Posts: 296
Joined: Sun Jun 22, 2014 4:45 pm
Location: Denmark

Re: The Next DSI Synthesizer

Postby Razmo » Mon Jun 30, 2014 6:06 pm

dslsynth wrote:I noticed a patch name in the announcement video where the word "para" occured. So let me guess that presets have to be programmed to be paraphonic and its not just a single switch. Maybe the oscillator settings matters much like running a Tetra in combo mode without unison mode set which gets round robin on the voice allocation. But lets have Carson explain the details. Or wait for the DSI manual at the end of next month or so.

I really like the idea of the new sequencer. Very much a good step forward from the Evolver design. Carsons explanation makes me wonder how the MIDI channel of a sequencer track is set and if polyphonic sequences are supported.


The Pro 2 is monophonic, so I doubt that the sequencer will be polyphonic... but again; we'll just have to wait and see :)

It also seems most logicl to make the paraphonic/monophonic switching to be part of the preset... the Waldorf Pulse 2 also has it as part of the preset.
User avatar
Razmo
 
Posts: 487
Joined: Sun Jun 29, 2014 7:29 pm

Re: The Next DSI Synthesizer

Postby dslsynth » Mon Jun 30, 2014 6:45 pm

Razmo wrote:The Pro 2 is monophonic, so I doubt that the sequencer will be polyphonic... but again; we'll just have to wait and see :)

Multiple sequence tracks to the same MIDI channel of a MIDI port with different notes should be able to do polyphonic sequencing at the price of having to record the multi note events one sequence track at a time.
User avatar
dslsynth
 
Posts: 296
Joined: Sun Jun 22, 2014 4:45 pm
Location: Denmark

Re: The Next DSI Synthesizer

Postby Slabwax » Wed Jul 02, 2014 3:52 pm

Just maybe the next DSI instrument will be eurorack kit. In the first Pro2 video the filter is shown and then again in Carson's new 30sec tease it's there again. I don't know if a few modules would constitute a new instrument here, but in other parts it would.
Slabwax
 
Posts: 13
Joined: Sat Jun 28, 2014 4:54 pm
Location: Ballard

Re: The Next DSI Synthesizer

Postby Razmo » Wed Jul 02, 2014 5:24 pm

At the moment no one even knows what filter it is that is in that black DSI filter module... I bet it's the SSM emulated one in the new Pro 2 synth, and that maybe they designed it as a step in the development of exactly that filter for use in the Pro 2 synth... maybe even for testing purposes. It would be common sense to make a module first, if you plan on making a new descrete component filter for a synth, for testing it out and such before committing it to the synth. Also, when that synth sports CV outs for controlling modular gear, it makes this choise of designing the new filter at a module even more logical I think because then you can test it on the CV outs as well...

When you think of it, with all those CV out's on the Pro 2 synth, it would be almost logical for DSI to start on this path of modular synthesis as well, offering modules specifically targeted at the Pro 2 as "add ons"...

...but I'm still only guessing here :)
User avatar
Razmo
 
Posts: 487
Joined: Sun Jun 29, 2014 7:29 pm

PreviousNext

Return to DSI News and Wild Speculation



Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest

cron