Pro 2 Announced

Information and discussion about the DSI Pro 2.

Re: Pro 2 Announced

Postby namnibor » Sat Jul 19, 2014 11:34 am

Thank you! SOLD! This will be MUCH easier and not with cryptic button combos and totally non-intuitive (for me) as what my Elektron experience was like--the Pro 2 sequencer actually has some features akin to my Spectralis and some still awaiting implementation this year.
The Pro 2 seems like a Swiss Army knife for the studio. I already have a Pulse 2 and other monos but to be able to drive them al from one hardware sequencer is really appealing and again, intuitive.
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Re: Pro 2 Announced

Postby dslsynth » Sat Jul 19, 2014 12:34 pm

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Re: Pro 2 Announced

Postby namnibor » Sun Jul 20, 2014 12:20 am

Anyone else find it odd that the old DSI Forum still dos not have a Pro 2 sub-forum posted as of now? I know it was just released and today is last day of Summer NAMM 2014, but one would think this addition would not have to wait until they are actually shipping the pro 2? Right?
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Re: Pro 2 Announced

Postby peter m mahr » Tue Jul 22, 2014 10:29 am

Agreed! But probably they are really waiting until DSI starts shipping the Pro 2.

As I had a unit for programming factory sounds, I can share my thoughts.

Actually I can put all together in two sentences. So far the Moog Voyager was the unrivaled monophonic synthesizer in my studio (http://www.petermmahr.com/studio/#Photo ... 6023532149). But after playing with the Pro 2 I am seriously thinking of selling the Moog. Something three weeks ago I thought will never ever happen...

Why?

First of all there is nearly nothing the Pro 2 cannot do what the Voyager does. In most cases the Pro 2 can do it better and to me has more to offer. The sonic range is wider than the Voyager's. And I do not primarily refer to the flexibility of the digital oscillators and their many waveforms. What surprised me was the new LPF of the Pro 2. Use the moog filter, increase the resonance and you know what I am talking about. Beside that I got the impression that the Pro 2 has more overtones, which is a good combination if you have a strong LPF. What I mean by that? Take for example a sine wave and the best LPF would not have that much impact it could have. I also liked the idea of feeding the two filers with different oscillators. Although I doubt that I will use it often, but it is a nice and welcome addition. Ok, the Voyager has the "Spacing" which is very nice feature, especially when routed to the pad.

With the initially OS version of the Pro 2, I was not that much convinced about what I like to call the "TyT" filter (Thank you Tom). I somehow expected something different. However, this has changed after DSI released a new OS. Now it really goes into the direction I expected it. On the downside, I had to reprogram some of my sounds.

As a fan of fast envelopes the Pro 2 is what I want, and the Voyager is great in it too! I think they are very close to each other and I have no complains for either of the two. There are probably other points of the Pro 2 worth to be mentioned, but one is definitely worth not to become forgotten - the step sequencer (32x8tracks or 16x16tracks). I never used any a lot before, but this step sequencer I simply love (examples "Barracuda", "Hotzenblogs" and "Max Arena"). It is so convenient to use and getting results is easy. "Max Arena" is probably also a good example for the modulation possibilities, although musically probably quite senseless :lol: . Look at the number of available EGs, LFOs and the modulation sources/destinations. Needless to say that controlling modulation by the two Sliders, ModWheel and Aftertouch is what makes this instrument alive.

The overall sound I would describe as "more direct" compared to the P12, for example listen to:
P12 “Delay Bass” https://soundcloud.com/petermmahr/dsi-p ... m-soundset
Pro 2 “Delay Bass” https://soundcloud.com/petermmahr/dsi-p ... /dsi-pro-2

In the case of the P12 the thickness comes from the Unison Mode, whereas the Pro 2 uses the new Super Saw waveforms.

The Pro 2 can become very strong on the lower end, so take care of your subwoofer and your ears! I had to cut the lower frequencies from the "Wavedrum" example btw.

Here are some Pro 2 sound demos I recorded during the work: https://soundcloud.com/petermmahr/sets/dsi-pro-2

Peter

IMPORTANT NOTE - Please do not forget, this was a pre production unit for sound programming purposes. Therefore please do not make any assumptions on what finally is released and included. I posted my personal impressions based on the unit I had for a certain time. I am not affiliated with DSI and post my personal impressions based on my personal taste.
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Re: Pro 2 Announced

Postby Paul Dither » Tue Jul 22, 2014 10:40 am

namnibor wrote:Anyone else find it odd that the old DSI Forum still dos not have a Pro 2 sub-forum posted as of now? I know it was just released and today is last day of Summer NAMM 2014, but one would think this addition would not have to wait until they are actually shipping the pro 2? Right?


Let's not forget that the DSI Forum is not run by DSI. So it's not like DSI is holding back something when a sub-forum hasn't been created yet.
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Re: Pro 2 Announced

Postby Paul Dither » Tue Jul 22, 2014 11:20 am

@Peter:

Thanks a lot for your post! It's always a pleasure to take a look at your lovely studio space as well as listening to your patches. The latter definitely played a big role in considering the Pro 2 as a future investment.

It's interesting what you write about the Pro 2 and the Voyager. It makes me really curious to check out the new LPF in person.
Could you maybe elaborate on how the "TyT" filter now really goes into the direction you expected it? I'm just wondering about how an OS update could have had an influence on its behaviour.

The sequencer seems indeed to be very easy to handle as also the Summer NAMM videos have shown, especially when it comes to the automation of parameters. I have one question with regard to the latter though: When you press down 'record' and play with the filter cutoff, and then press down 'record' again and play with one of the delay amounts (all of these are just random examples now), does the step sequencer automatically jump to a new track depending on what parameter you choose to record/automate, or do you have to assign the different parameters to a track in between those recording steps? I'm asking because in the recent NAMM videos it seemed as if Carson was just assigning all kinds of parameters without any interruption.


PS: I really became a fan of your "Barracuda" patch.
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Re: Pro 2 Announced

Postby peter m mahr » Tue Jul 22, 2014 1:31 pm

Poptones wrote:Thanks a lot for your post! It's always a pleasure to take a look at your lovely studio space as well as listening to your patches. The latter definitely played a big role in considering the Pro 2 as a future investment.


So in case you do not like the Pro 2, you can blame it then on me. :D But I am pretty sure you will not regret your decision. I am hoping to get one as well soon. And I am keen on recording a track with the Pro 2 and its big polyphonic brother P12. If Dave ever releases a Prophet5 MkII or a 600 MkII with analog oscillators and the new filters then I am afraid I have to consider that one as well. Hm... or a successor of the P2000 sampler. :lol:

Btw - Thank you very much for your kind feedback! I am glad you like some of the patches.

Poptones wrote:It's interesting what you write about the Pro 2 and the Voyager. It makes me really curious to check out the new LPF in person.
Could you maybe elaborate on how the "TyT" filter now really goes into the direction you expected it? I'm just wondering about how an OS update could have had an influence on its behaviour.


I was actually also very surprised after I heard the filter under the new OS. If I did not calibrate the filters before starting the work on the patches and after the update, I would have blamed it to be the reason. It might have had something to do with the controllers and their range, but this is pure speculation and not based on facts. Therefore it has to be treated with caution. Bottom line is, that the TyT/SEM kind filter now works as I would have expected it from that kind of filter. In my opinion a good decision and a nice choice.

Poptones wrote:The sequencer seems indeed to be very easy to handle as also the Summer NAMM videos have shown, especially when it comes to the automation of parameters. I have one question with regard to the latter though: When you press down 'record' and play with the filter cutoff, and then press down 'record' again and play with one of the delay amounts (all of these are just random examples now), does the step sequencer automatically jump to a new track depending on what parameter you choose to record/automate, or do you have to assign the different parameters to a track in between those recording steps? I'm asking because in the recent NAMM videos it seemed as if Carson was just assigning all kinds of parameters without any interruption.


Yeah, that was my impression as well and I am not 100% sure, but I think you have to assign in advance. At least with the OS I had, but I am not 100% sure and cannot check anymore. Sorry.

Poptones wrote:PS: I really became a fan of your "Barracuda" patch.


Well... you have to blame our colleague "trooper" [@ synthesizerforum.de] for the "Barracuda" patch. He asked me to record a sound with more modulation on it. So I started from the Init patch and ended up quite fast with this sound. I should have recorded the sound before pushing the "play" button as this would show what is possible... but on the other hand there are many demos out now and I am sure there will follow many more once the Pro 2 is ready for sale.

Cheers,
Peter
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Re: Pro 2 Announced

Postby Paul Dither » Tue Jul 22, 2014 2:16 pm

Thanks for your comprehensive answer! And be prepared to be blamed after my purchase. ;)
No, seriously, I think I can estimate very well, whether I like the basic character of the Pro 2 or not - even via soundclips only. And the patches you and others have already designed cover quite a bit of what I'm after. Apart from personal sound preferences, I think that the Pro 2 offers a great variety - from gnarly DAF-esque bass sounds to modern sound design extravaganza. Nevertheless, I'm going to wait until it becomes available to be able to check it out in a store first. Especially since I don't like to cancel my Sub 37 preorder, and I'd have to get rid of something else in advance - namely, my MEK. The latter would be tough, but if the Pro 2 ultimatey convinces me, then so be it.
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Re: Pro 2 Announced

Postby namnibor » Fri Jul 25, 2014 10:24 am

Really nice demo's showing the very wide sonic palette of Pro2. Definitely will be wanting to know more about the sequencer as well. For instance, I wonder if one could connect a Tetra via midi and have the sequencer play 4 different programs on 4 different tracks and how great the midi nexus is to do such things. I have a feeling the sequencer hides much more potential/power than what's been disclosed thus far. Could be wrong, but inquiring minds want to know! :P
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Re: Pro 2 Announced

Postby cbmd » Sat Jul 26, 2014 5:54 am

funny you should ask Namnibor. The exact arrangement between a Pro 2 and Tetra is briefly shown in the original demo vid.

http://youtu.be/vNp85kiMXK0?t=4m15s

Enjoy!
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Re: Pro 2 Announced

Postby dslsynth » Sat Jul 26, 2014 12:31 pm

@namnibor: Prophet 12 have around 100 modulation distinations. Pro2 got around 150 or so for the sequencer according to the intro video.

A qualified guess is that the MIDI port and MIDI channel numbers are encoded into the modulation destination for the sequencer such as MIDI_1_Channel_1, MIDI_1_Channel_2, ..., MIDI_2_Channel_15. If you get the idea. Under such a system one assigns a sequence track to a specific MIDI port/channel and do the magic in the sequence track contents. It looks quite flexible!

@cbmd: Let me guess that without the knowledge you guys have at DSI it may be a little difficult to know exactly how the new voice architecture work in details. Even if the question related behaviour have already been demonstrated visually. One really have to know your voice architecture designs to make a qualified guess.

And yes, you guessed correctly: really look forward to read the Pro2 manual. ;-)

And yes, I see Pro2 as quite a few steps in the right direction (modulo credit card related topics).
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Re: Pro 2 Announced

Postby namnibor » Sat Jul 26, 2014 10:28 pm

cbmd wrote:funny you should ask Namnibor. The exact arrangement between a Pro 2 and Tetra is briefly shown in the original demo vid.

http://youtu.be/vNp85kiMXK0?t=4m15s

Enjoy!


@Carson-- THANKS! So *THAT* is what is happening in that second and half in video with Tetra?! So at the same time one could run the Tetra's audio INTO and THROUGH the Pro2 and mangle the sound via the filters and such having advantage of both the two new low pass filter designs and the Tetra's low pass, right? I hope you guys at DSI do a few more videos showing how exactly the sequencer addresses things?

For instance: Are other "sequencer lines" actually "modulation tracks" (similar to how the Spectralis, for instance, addresses) and can the sequencer lines be both modulation lines AND new sequences? Or...are certain tracks pre-assigned for specific duties or all freely assignable? Example: Is say, track 10 of sequencer reserved for percussion/drums, or are even the midi channels freely assignable per sequencer track? Does the sequencer "play nice" with others due to a rather comprehensive midi implementation? Could each voice of the P12 be assigned a sequencer track or is this getting a bit too deep? ;)

The Pro2 is the direction in which I am sure to be an early adopter of: new filters, paraphonic, sequencer, CV/Gate. Have been really pleasantly surprised while listening to various sound designer's sounds from the Pro2.

Carson--could DSI also demonstrate and elaborate on the added new "SUPER WAVES" as well?

Thanks in advance and just to be clear, I WILL NOT part/sell my MEK for the Pro2...no, I think they will augment each other quite nicely.
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Re: Pro 2 Announced

Postby cbmd » Sun Jul 27, 2014 1:09 am

Hey Namnibor,

So at the same time one could run the Tetra's audio INTO and THROUGH the Pro2 and mangle the sound via the filters and such having advantage of both the two new low pass filter designs and the Tetra's low pass, right?


Indeed! :o

Sequencer track 1 is reserved for Note data and the other Sequencer tracks are freely assignable to any modulation destination. Destinations included MIDI out 1 and 2, each with the ability to address all 16 MIDI channels.

I'm surprised none of you guys have found the vids from Nashville NAMM yet:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Uyju76KN ... oGlbBesRbQ

That's all for now, back to work!
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Re: Pro 2 Announced

Postby Razmo » Sun Jul 27, 2014 7:57 am

cbmd wrote:Hey Namnibor,

So at the same time one could run the Tetra's audio INTO and THROUGH the Pro2 and mangle the sound via the filters and such having advantage of both the two new low pass filter designs and the Tetra's low pass, right?


Indeed! :o

Sequencer track 1 is reserved for Note data and the other Sequencer tracks are freely assignable to any modulation destination. Destinations included MIDI out 1 and 2, each with the ability to address all 16 MIDI channels.

I'm surprised none of you guys have found the vids from Nashville NAMM yet:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Uyju76KN ... oGlbBesRbQ

That's all for now, back to work!


"The Pro 12" :lol: ... be careful Carson, with what you say... users might take notice of such a statement, and before you know it, false rumors will be spreading like wild fire :D
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Re: Pro 2 Announced

Postby Razmo » Sun Jul 27, 2014 8:07 am

I'm really in doubt if to get the Pro 2 or Tempest next month... still... more and more I'm leaning towards the Pro 2, getting the Tempest later.

One of the reasons is that I intent on selling my Yamaha EX5 keyboard, but then I'd need a new master keyboard, and I hope that the Pro 2 would be able to take care of this part as well... does anyone in here, who actualy tried the Pro 2, have a comment about the feel of the Pro 2's keybed? ... I'm used to the EX5's supperb keybed, so I'm a little worried with the quality of the Pro 2's keybed to be honest. I think I'll be able to live with the 3½ octave keybed, as this seems to be my absolute minimum size.

I also hear DSI (Carson you say it in the video above as well) tell me, that each oscillator has it's own envelope... can you be a bit more specific with the details of this? ... I'm pretty certain this does not go for the filter EGs, as it's paraphonic... but what about the VCA? ... does the Pro 2 have four of these to accomplish individual volume EGs, placed before a mixer, before the filters? ... or is it like I suspect; a digital envelope for each oscillator in the DSP code?

Not that it matters much to me, I'm just currious...
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Re: Pro 2 Announced

Postby Razmo » Sun Jul 27, 2014 8:17 am

cbmd wrote:Hey Namnibor,

So at the same time one could run the Tetra's audio INTO and THROUGH the Pro2 and mangle the sound via the filters and such having advantage of both the two new low pass filter designs and the Tetra's low pass, right?


Indeed! :o

Sequencer track 1 is reserved for Note data and the other Sequencer tracks are freely assignable to any modulation destination. Destinations included MIDI out 1 and 2, each with the ability to address all 16 MIDI channels.

I'm surprised none of you guys have found the vids from Nashville NAMM yet:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Uyju76KN ... oGlbBesRbQ

That's all for now, back to work!


I'm just thinking... if the Pro 2 only has one track for triggering note-ons, then you would NOT be able to trigger a Tetra in Combo Mode, using all four voices independently... if this is indeed the way the sequencer works in the Pro 2, I can almost certainly say, that more triggering channels is what you'll be seeing as "feature requests" in the future.

I'm aware that the Pro 2 only has one Gate output, so that more than one such track would be overkill, but that's only when using it for modular stuff... you have two MIDI outputs assignable, and I bet that A LOT of users will want to use these to control more than one external synth with the Pro 2.

If more channels in the sequencer could produce note on/off, and route it to the two outputs, it would make one major powerful phrase sequencer for live performance... you could have your Pro 2, and maybe two other synths connected to each output (maybe even more if chained via MIDI Thru) and could use the sequencer for playing backing tracks, all of it controlled from the Pro 2. You could even add a single old analog synth with gate/cv as well.

I think it would be worth thinking about expanding the Pro 2 with multi-track capabilities this way... but that's of course only my opinion.
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Re: Pro 2 Announced

Postby cbmd » Sun Jul 27, 2014 8:34 am

If more channels in the sequencer could produce note on/off, and route it to the two outputs, it would make one major powerful phrase sequencer for live performance... you could have your Pro 2, and maybe two other synths connected to each output (maybe even more if chained via MIDI Thru) and could use the sequencer for playing backing tracks, all of it controlled from the Pro 2. You could even add a single old analog synth with gate/cv as well.


yeah man, that's pretty much how the sequencer works. The tracks can be freely assigned to any of the modulation destinations. Mod dests include CV out 1-4 and MIDI out 1 or 2 channels 1-16.

I'm just thinking... if the Pro 2 only has one track for triggering note-ons, then you would NOT be able to trigger a Tetra in Combo Mode, using all four voices independently


Umm I just posted the exact section of the intro Pro 2 vid where this exact behavior is occurring. What more evidence could you ask for!?
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Re: Pro 2 Announced

Postby Razmo » Sun Jul 27, 2014 8:53 am

cbmd wrote:
If more channels in the sequencer could produce note on/off, and route it to the two outputs, it would make one major powerful phrase sequencer for live performance... you could have your Pro 2, and maybe two other synths connected to each output (maybe even more if chained via MIDI Thru) and could use the sequencer for playing backing tracks, all of it controlled from the Pro 2. You could even add a single old analog synth with gate/cv as well.


yeah man, that's pretty much how the sequencer works. The tracks can be freely assigned to any of the modulation destinations. Mod dests include CV out 1-4 and MIDI out 1 or 2 channels 1-16.

I'm just thinking... if the Pro 2 only has one track for triggering note-ons, then you would NOT be able to trigger a Tetra in Combo Mode, using all four voices independently


Umm I just posted the exact section of the intro Pro 2 vid where this exact behavior is occurring. What more evidence could you ask for!?


Umm... you wrote to Namnibor:

"Sequencer track 1 is reserved for Note data and the other Sequencer tracks are freely assignable to any modulation destination"

I read that as track 1 being the only track that can send note information, while the rest of them only work as mod. sequencers... how would you control both the Pro 2 engine, two external synths (or more) plus an analog synth with just one track doing note data? ...

or am I misunderstanding what you wrote?
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Re: Pro 2 Announced

Postby cbmd » Sun Jul 27, 2014 9:00 am

What part of of my previous post did you misunderstand?
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Re: Pro 2 Announced

Postby Razmo » Sun Jul 27, 2014 9:12 am

cbmd wrote:What part of of my previous post did you misunderstand?


I'm not certain I misunderstood anything, that's why I'm asking you if I did...

You wrote to Namnibor that only track 1 will send note data... and then I ask, how do you control more than one external synth track with note data, if only one track will send note data?

The way I understood it is, that you have up to 16 tracks with 32 steps each in the sequencer, and that track 1 is the one that is gating envelopes, and triggering notes, while the rest 15 sequencer tracks can be used to modulate parameters.

If that's correct, I don't understand how you'd be able to make the sequencer play different patterns (note ons/offs etc.) on both it's internal engine, a connected analog synth via CV/Gate and other external MIDI gear? (at the same time of course!)
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